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I found the following sentences in an English language texbook (written by a non-native speaker) and I'm not sure about them. I've tried to find similar examples elsewhere, but couldn't. I think the sentences exist only in this book and not in real speech. Here they are:

1) He ordered the letter to be translated.

2) I told the books to be brought.

3) He asked for the dictionary to be brought.

The question is: are they correct? Shouldn't it be something like: He ordered that the letter (should) be translated?

Are these three sentences fine or wrong? Do native speakers construct sentences like that frequently?

Community
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Starcatcher7
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  • Or He ordered it be {translated}, where I suppose that "bare infinitive" is "subjunctive". But you can't tell books to do anything - the verb *tell* doesn't work the same as *order* or *ask*. I suppose in principle you could tell a slave to be bought, but it's pretty weird. – FumbleFingers May 24 '15 at 18:38
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    Certainly not with tell. Any NP following tell will be interpreted as the addressee. Ask can take a passive infinitive with a full for..to complementizer (He asked for it to be brought = For it to be brought is what he asked; both mean He asked for them to bring it). With the for in He asked for them to bring it, the addressee of the request is indefinite; without the for, in He asked them to bring it, the addressee of the request was definitely them. – John Lawler May 24 '15 at 18:43
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    Dropping the "to" here sounds rather peculiar. If you're going to use the subjective, it sounds better---at least to my ear---to use "that": "He order that the letter be translated", "He asked that the dictionary be brought". Both OK. But in the original "dictionary" sentence, only dropping "to" sounds just plain wrong. – A.Ellett May 24 '15 at 18:46
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    Ok, but what about He ordered the letter to be translated? How would you understand this sentence? Does it mean that he ordered somebody to translate the letter or the letter to translate itself? Is it a natural-sounding sentence? – Starcatcher7 May 24 '15 at 18:52
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    @Starcatcher7: I assume we can rule out ordering letters and books to do things, since it doesn't make sense. I think some people would accept your version, but I'd rather go for He ordered the letter be translated, where there's an elided ordered [that]..., and an acceptable "subjunctive" (and an elided ...[should] be translated, if it makes the construction any easier). – FumbleFingers May 24 '15 at 18:55
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    The original direct imperatives were, "The letters are to be translated." "The books are to be brought." and "The dictionary is to be brought." I don't know if this is spell-casting or some sort of optative but I've certainly heard "The essay is to be on my desk by six o'clock." – Hugh May 24 '15 at 19:01
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    Told doesn't work (agreed @FumbleFingers, sure). It would have to be, "I specified... "I decided... – Hugh May 24 '15 at 19:05
  • "is to be..." is different than told, ordered or asked. Granted, it's imperative, but the construction is formed differently. Essentially, "is to" means must, which can indeed apply to the dictionary, or the essay. But whatever verb applies to the person addressed (perhaps "bring"), it is unstated. – Brian Hitchcock May 25 '15 at 11:47

2 Answers2

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The first two sentences are incorrect because they imply that the letter and books are being spoken to by a person as if they themselves were the addressees... The third sentence can be shortened without losing its meaning.

I would suggest the following:

  1. He ordered that the letter be translated or He ordered the translation of the letter.
  2. I requested that the books be brought or simply I asked for the books (with the understanding that they will be brought)
  3. He asked for the dictionary (it will need to be fetched)
Edwin Ashworth
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Marconius
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See I may not know the name of the rules but I suggest you to look at the pattern of my answers below.

1) He ordered them to have the letter translated.

2) I asked to have the books brought.

3) He asked to have the dictionary brought.

Arjun Parekh
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  • ...the to... in the first example seems like a typing mistake. Shouldn't the be erased? – Lucky May 25 '15 at 11:54
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    Of the 4 sentences in this answer, only sentence 3) (the 'dictionary' one) appears correct to me. – Hellion May 25 '15 at 22:56
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    @Lucky: I think the is supposed to be them. However, even with them in place to salvage sentence 1, sentence 2 (as Hellion observes) is still fatally flawed because it lacks a direct object for told. And since the answerer doesn't provide an explanation for why the proposed wordings are correct, each one lives or dies solely on its own unadorned merits (or lack thereof). Ultimately, this answer isn't at all helpful, in my opinion. – Sven Yargs May 26 '15 at 07:37