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Are these two sentences equivalent?

You needn't pay at once.

You don't need to pay at once.

If yes, which one would you recommend? Is it an US/GB thing?

Šime Vidas
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  • I think we learned in school they are different, but I forgot what was the difference. I'm curious to know too, so +1 – Frantisek May 20 '11 at 13:11
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    This question is from May 20, 2011, and has been viewed more than 20,000 times in the past seven years. It's hard to imagine that we would gain any practical benefit from closing it at this point. – Sven Yargs Jun 01 '18 at 04:33

5 Answers5

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They are equivalent in meaning; however, the non contracted forms would be

You need not pay at once.
You do not need to pay at once.

I think the first is more common in BrE (though I would request confirmation). The second formation is more common is AmE; however, we would more likely say

You don't need to pay right away.

snumpy
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    If the former was more common in BrE it is archaic now - I know not of any person who would speak in such a manner. – Andy F May 20 '11 at 13:15
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    It may be archaic for you, @AndyF, it's alive and well for me. But it is true that "need" has been for some while in process of changing from a full auxiliary like "must" into a lexical verb like "want". – Colin Fine May 20 '11 at 13:34
  • Perhaps a generational or regional distinction then, @Colin? I know for certain that if I used the construction "You needn't shout" instead of "You don't need to shout" it would be considered rather pretentious. I'm not saying that it's wrong, just that I don't hear many people speak that way from day to day (not that they're necessarily correct either, mind you). – Andy F May 20 '11 at 13:44
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    For me, that slightly ironic use in "You needn't shout!" (meaning "please don't shout") is exactly where I would most expect to here "needn't". – Colin Fine May 21 '11 at 00:26
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I initially just thought needn't is probably more British usage, but that it's becoming increasingly archaic / affected.

So I produced this NGram to support my thinking. Restricting to just American or British doesn't suggest it's much more common in either.

Frankly, I just don't know what to make of this one showing the latest trend.

Nevertheless, I'd still advise OP to use don't need to. I doubt anyone would think that meant he wasn't keeping up with the times.

cdlvcdlv
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FumbleFingers
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    You can always count on Google to pleasantly surprise you with a new cool service :) – Šime Vidas May 20 '11 at 13:37
  • becoming affected? It's sick?? Not too sure I understand what you mean by that sentence... – Alexis Wilke Jul 07 '14 at 03:37
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    @Alexis: You should get in the habit of googling things like define affected if you don't understand a usage (the second definition there is the relevant one: *pretentious and designed to impress*). – FumbleFingers Jul 07 '14 at 04:17
  • Google does not always give you the right answer! Thank you for taking the time to lighten the meaning in this case. We do not have that meaning in French for the verb "affecter". – Alexis Wilke Jul 07 '14 at 04:24
  • @Alexis: On reflection I suppose it might not have been obvious to you sense #2 rather than sense #1 (influenced or touched by an external factor) was the one that applied in my usage. It crops up a lot on ELU though, so you'd best remember it! :) – FumbleFingers Jul 07 '14 at 04:36
  • Hello FF, there is an edit suggestion pending and I think it is suggested because your Ngram Viewer links don't show anything related with needn't or don't need to. –  Jul 19 '16 at 08:38
  • A) I don't understand the significance of the Ngram to your answer. B) Do Brits use the phrase? Is it generational? – Arm the good guys in America Nov 14 '17 at 15:07
  • @Clare: NGrams / Google Books don't handle apostrophes very well (plus they always tend to over-represent older and more formal written forms over current natural speech). Presumably my intention (over 6 years ago) was to provide statistical evidence to support what I said in my answer. The fact of the matter is the vast majority of native speakers would rarely if ever say things like You needn't go - they'd say You don't need to go. I think it's a bit pointless speculating as to whether the few that do still use the outdated form are concentrated by region, age group, etc. – FumbleFingers Nov 14 '17 at 15:39
  • @FumbleFingers: These are far below needn't and don't have to, which are both above don't need to, but just for fun, here are some colloquialisms – shoover Nov 14 '17 at 17:29
  • @shoover: Don't get me started! Whenever I flag up the AmE usage What do you got?, everyone here assures me I'm simply mishearing What ['ve] you got?, but I've often heard the "syntactic garbage" version enunciated so clearly that it's simply not possible to believe the speaker didn't intend to use the verb *to do*. – FumbleFingers Nov 14 '17 at 17:37
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We can both use need not and don't need to. However, if needn't is followed by an object, we must use don't need.

For example : You don't need your coat. It's not cold outside.

"Coat" is an object, so it is wrong to say ,"You needn't your coat".

Raghav
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Vivian Batula
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When the Americans want to express a lack of obligation, they use the helping verb (do) with negative (not) followed by need. Brits drop the helping verb and contract not

You needn't pay at once. Brits

You don't need to pay at once. Americans

that simple

Sam
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    Do you have some reference that supports this explanation? – Davo Nov 14 '17 at 15:06
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    As a 30-something Brit, nah. "needn't" sounds archaic. – AndyT Nov 14 '17 at 15:31
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    @AndyT: As a 60-something Brit, I suggest "archaic" might be a bit strong (though I dissent not from your substantive point - it's at the very least a dated / formal usage today! :) Whatever - I seriously disagree with the conflation of Brits and "old-fashioned" constructions implied by this answer. If anything, I'd say on average AmE tends to preserve older forms more than BrE in natural spoken contexts today. – FumbleFingers Nov 14 '17 at 16:48
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    @FumbleFingers - I'd be happy to call it "dated" rather than "archaic", but I stole the word from your own answer... ;) – AndyT Nov 14 '17 at 16:54
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    @AndyT: Hoist by my own petard! In my defence, I did try to "hedge" my assertion by saying it was *becoming increasingly* so, and conflating *archaic* with *affected. Mind you, if this question had been asked today*, I'd have voted to migrate to English Language Learners rather than posting an answer here. – FumbleFingers Nov 14 '17 at 17:27
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They are not equivalent.

You needn't pay means that you paid and you're sorry you did.

You don't need to pay mean that you didn't pay and don't have to.

jimm101
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Desislava Staneva
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    That's wrong actually. You needn't have paid (payment was unnecessary) You didn't need to pay (payment was not necessary) – Mari-Lou A Nov 19 '18 at 14:42