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In each quotation beneath, what happens if I replace with for which determination? Does anything change?

In Current Sailing a resultant has to be found for two simultaneous courses and distances. Oblique Sailing is a term applied to those cases for the determination of which an oblique triangle has to be solved. The above is the accurate use of the term "Plane Sailing", but it is sometimes loosely used as a synonym for the equally ill-used term "Navigation", as contrasted with "Nautical Astronomy".

Glossary of Navigation: A Vade Mecum for Practical Navigators by J. B. Harbord. p 305.

The Supreme Court, reversing the Circuit Court, held 1 that the act was valid and enforceable. The irrigation of really arid lands is a public use, and the question whether any particular land will be benefited is one of fact, for the determination of which the act made suffcient provision.

A Treatise on the Power of Taxation, State and Federal, in the United States by Frederick Newton Judson. p 447.

If Mill were taken literally the whole definition would end up as a mere tautology. For in order to discover how often a certain sum of money changes hands in effecting the sale and purchase of a given quantity of goods, it is neces- sary to know the average price of the goods in question, which is precisely the quantity for the determination of which the (amount and) velocity of circulation of money are to be utilised. In other words, velocity of circulation as defined by Mill could not be regarded as an independent factor in the determination of average price.

Interest and Prices by Knut Wicksell. p 51.

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    Yes, it changes, and, to keep the meaning constant, you could use "for determining which". Although, the current versions read well enough. – niamulbengali Dec 23 '20 at 06:17
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    I think the phrase for the determination of which is clunky at best. And you're right— only that you have to use whose instead of which: for whose determination. – user405662 Dec 23 '20 at 07:30
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    To add to the above, some people object to "whose" being used for inanimate objects (which may be behind the clunky use of "of which") but most reputable sources say it's ok in this sense, e.g. https://www.merriam-webster.com/words-at-play/whose-used-for-inanimate-objects – Stuart F Dec 23 '20 at 12:31
  • There's a possible wrong-way traffic issue with your switch. ABC for which (or for whose) determination can imply that ABC has or owns a determination, rather than we need to do the determination to get there. Consider that legalese is not written for ease and clarity, but for 'fixed phraseology that worked before'. – Yosef Baskin Jan 19 '21 at 23:33

3 Answers3

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The key difference between the two phrases is the usage of "which."

"For the determination of which" refers to the method (determination) of calculating (determining) X, where X is described after the phrase. There is an emphasis on calculating X, because "which" refers to the X described later in the sentence. In your example:

In Current Sailing a resultant has to be found for two simultaneous courses and distances. Oblique Sailing is a term applied to those cases for the determination of which an oblique triangle has to be solved.

It refers to how to solve an oblique triangle.

"For which determination" instead refers to the selection of which method to choose. The emphasis is on "which determination," because "which" now refers to the "determination" instead of X. This implies that there are multiple different methods (determinations), in a similar style to the example "Which pen are you using?". In the previous example but changed to include this phrase:

In Current Sailing a resultant has to be found for two simultaneous courses and distances. Oblique Sailing is a term applied to those cases for which determination an oblique triangle has to be solved.

It now refers to the choice of the method (determination) with which to solve an oblique triangle, instead of simply solving the oblique triangle. The definition of Oblique sailing in this example is hence different to the original example. The meaning of the phrase will change similarly in your other two examples.

MBorg
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  • Thanks. Can you please edit your answer to elaborate how ""For which determination" instead refers to the selection of which method to choose."? None of the three quotations above contain any words alluding to "the selection of which method". Where does "the choice of the method" spring from? –  Jan 23 '21 at 04:45
  • @Intellectuallydisabled I editted my answer accordingl. It's actually related to the wording of "For which determination" vs " for the determination of which" instead of the rest of the quote, specifically with how the word "which" is used. – MBorg Jan 23 '21 at 04:56
  • Thanks. Sorry...I still don't understand. First, can you please edit your answer again to elaborate how this implies that "This implies that there are multiple different "determinations,""? –  Jan 25 '21 at 05:13
  • How are multiple different "determinations," "analogous to multiple different methods"? Determinations doesn't mean the same thing as methods.
  • –  Jan 25 '21 at 05:14
  • I've slightly editted my answer in response to your two comments. I hope it is clearer now. – MBorg Jan 26 '21 at 15:13
  • John Lawler disagrees with you. He wrote that the meaning remains same. He wrote "As for replacing it with for which determination, that would be perfectly grammatical, and should mean the same." Can you pls respond to his answer? Now I'm baffled...who's correct??? Can you please edit your answer, rather than reply in comments? Comments can get deleted. –  Jan 10 '22 at 08:29
  • So can answers. We are talking about different things. I'm talking about syntax, and not about the law. Judges and lawyers do strange things with language, because they have strange ideas about it. – John Lawler Jan 10 '22 at 16:04