What is finished the verb or the object?

Question

Is it correct to say?

A: What did you do yesterday?
B: I woke up, had a shower, wrote a book and then went to work. (I didn't write the whole book) 1:03 --- 1:10 a teacher from YouTube, please have a look

A: What did you do yesterday?
B: I went to the library and read some books. (I didn't read the books in their entirety)

A: What did you do yesterday?
B: Well, many things. I knitted my sweater, read some books, built a wooden ship. (I'm going to finish them in the future)

I read /rɛd/ Tom Sawyer to my son almost every night. (I didn't read the whole book every night, only several pages)

"Did you read the Bible yesterday?"

I think a native speaker would say "I did some work on my book/sweater/model ship" and "I did some reading". — Kate Bunting, Feb 17 '22 at 10:41
Idiomatically, there's usually a big difference between I [read | wrote] a book, because we naturally use context to decide whether the *read* version implies *...to completion, but (particularly with the indefinite article) the wrote* version nearly always implies "completion", so in a context where that's impossible, such as I wrote a book while I waited for her to phone me back, we're forced to assume a "facetious" usage (there was no actual book, but I would have had time to write one; the implication is she didn't phone me back for a *very* long time! :) — FumbleFingers, Feb 17 '22 at 15:29
@FumbleFingers Here I've got a video on youtube from a native English speaker, who was explaining Past Simple. At 1:03 he said something. I'd love to hear your opinion on his example. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SfVTb3AaE0U&ab_channel=%D0%94%D0%B6%D0%B0%D1%81%D1%82%D0%B8%D0%BD — IlyaTretyakov, Feb 17 '22 at 18:23
If you want to reopen the question you need the votes of another two members. I have cast my vote, but I think if you edited the question and showed the research, which does not necessarily means a link to YouTube but an actual reference from a reliable source then we're good to go. The fact that a moderator, Andrew Leach, answered your question plays into your favour. And before accusing people of being totalitarian look up the rules of closing questions and when comments can or have to be deleted. — Mari-Lou A, Feb 17 '22 at 19:07
@Mitch Thank you very much for your help. I learned this in the second grade of school, though. Imagine: You're building a wooden model of a ship that a friend of yours gave you. You're building and building and building. Later in the future you decide to give it up and never continue. That friend asks you: "Did you build it?" Do you think "No, I didn't" is the thing I should answer with? — IlyaTretyakov, Feb 18 '22 at 09:12
Every one of your sentences is correct. None is wrong. Except I would say: Read **a(( book, Did you build it? I started building it but I didn't finish it. Simple past. — Lambie, Feb 20 '22 at 18:36
Most Slavic languages have specific verbal inflections that distinguish some kinds of actions from their completive aspects. I.e, a different form of the verb is used when saying "read a book" if you read the whole book, versus reading part of the book. English doesn't have anything like that, and we have to use a hot mess of idioms and special constructions like the ones you see here to convey the same information that Russian (for example) gets out of a simple verb inflection. It's kind of the opposite of using articles -- Russian has nothing like them and they bother Russian speakers. — John Lawler, Jun 05 '22 at 14:34

score 4 · Answer 1 · answered Feb 20 '22 at 19:11

Language is squishy, and there are often exceptions to language 'rules'.

Nevertheless, it's often the case that a claim to an act of construction is equivalent to a claim to completing the construct, whereas a claim to an act of perception can be made when only a portion of the whole has been perceived.

For example, "I built a boat" means that I built the whole boat, while "I saw a boat" doesn't imply having inspected every plank and nail of the boat. Seeing even a silhouette of the boat through a fog can count as having 'seen' it.

Hence in your examples, writing, knitting and building (all acts of construction) would tend to be understood as claiming to have completed the construction. But reading wouldn't necessarily be understood as a claim to having read every word.

As mentioned, there are exceptions. For example, if you are asked whether you have read the instructions, the question is asking whether you have read and understood the instructions in their entirety. Conversely, nouns that convey incompleteness can affect how verbs of construction are understood - e.g. "I have made progress" isn't the same as a claim to have progressed all the way to the end. It is in this case equivalent to "I have made some progress".

Thank you. That's very helpful. – IlyaTretyakov Feb 20 '22 at 19:42 — IlyaTretyakov, Feb 20 '22 at 19:42
@IlyaTretyakov You're welcome. – Lawrence Mar 06 '22 at 16:15 — Lawrence, Mar 06 '22 at 16:15

score 2 · Answer 2 · answered Feb 17 '22 at 11:07

2

Yes: the rule is correct and your sentences do not mean what you want them to mean.

"I wrote a book" means exactly that: you wrote the book, in its entirety, and completed that action. If you only wrote part of a book, you need to say that: "I wrote some more pages of my book".

The same applies to all your sentences.

There may be more idiomatic ways to say what you did.

I woke up, had a shower, wrote a bit more of my book and then went to work.
I went to the library and dipped into some books.
Well, many things. I carried on knitting my sweater, read a bit, built some more of my wooden ship.

All of these actions are completed, but the actions are specific. You only built part of your ship.

answered Feb 17 '22 at 11:07

Andrew Leach

101,901

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The problem is that if I say "I read a bit", I may be asked "What book did you read?" Another problem is that if I say "I played that computer game" it doesn't mean that I finished the game (because I didn't have much time), since that why do you think "I read the book" mean the whole book? And are you really sure you can't say "I read(red) Tom Sawyer to my son almost every night" if you didn't read the whole book each time? – IlyaTretyakov Feb 17 '22 at 11:32
Commonsense tells us that you didn't read the whole of Tom Sawyer every night, but to make it clearer you could say "I read from Tom Sawyer", or that you read a chapter or a few pages. – Kate Bunting Feb 17 '22 at 11:48
Kate Bunting, thank you very much. The problem is that I want to understand if it is wrong to say or not. For example: We went to the beach. They played tennis while I read that book. It's disappointing that I can't say that just because I didn't finish the book that day. – IlyaTretyakov Feb 17 '22 at 11:51
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But "Did you read the Bible yesterday?" is idiomatic and would be taken as meaning "Did you do some Bible reading yesterday?" As usual, 'rules' are rules of thumb. – Edwin Ashworth Feb 17 '22 at 12:05
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If someone manages to read an entire book in one sitting, that's what they'll say "I read (all of) Les Miserables in one day/one night" . Sometimes @IlyaTretyakov, people use more words to express more precisely what they mean, but more often than not, listeners will use their own experience to fill in the gaps. Is this different in any language? Is there a language where the phrase "Yesterday he read the Bible" must mean he read every single page of the Bible? – Mari-Lou A Feb 17 '22 at 12:08
@Mari-LouA, this is exactly what I'm talking about! This really makes sense. "I played that computer game" doesnt mean I finished it. "I built that ship" doesn't mean I finished it. Otherwise English would have to be improved. But your reasonable words completely contradicts what Andrew Leach said. – IlyaTretyakov Feb 17 '22 at 12:11
A lot of it is based on context and convention. "I played the game" suggests you played the game for a while: a lot of games you can't complete in the way you might complete Super Mario Brothers (get to the end of the final level). "I read a book" doesn't necessarily mean you read all of the book, which is why you could say "I read all of the book", but in some circumstances it might mean you read it all. If in doubt you can indicate whether you completed it or not by saying "I read all of" or "I read some of", but often it won't matter or you can clarify if someone asks. – Stuart F Feb 17 '22 at 12:21
@IlyaTretyakov We did the shopping this morning ( but tomorrow we will go shopping again) He worked until 10PM ( but that person will likely work the next day, and the next) To "finish" an action does not mean it cannot be repeated. it means at some point in the past the action was completed. "Yesterday I wrote a book" sounds like the action started and finished within one day. Just like "Yesterday I bought a car" means the speaker purchased a car but some people cannot afford to pay a lump sum and will pay in installments. This will be clarified upon asking. – Mari-Lou A Feb 17 '22 at 12:22
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I wrote a book is actually unusual because it suggests completion more strongly than many expressions in simple past tense. This is maybe because there are so many ways of saying "I wrote something shorter than a book" (I wrote in a book, I wrote some of my book, I wrote a chapter of my book, I wrote a little.) and because writing any of a book is an unusual thing for most people to do, so you don't say it often. – Stuart F Feb 17 '22 at 12:24
If I asked someone what that did the night before, and they answered, "I read a book," I would assume they read some pages of a book. If I asked someone what they did over their vacation, and they said, "I read a book," I would assume they read an entire book. Time is taken into account. Because we know that books take a long time to write, "I wrote a book last night," would be greeted with skepticism, awe (least likely), or amusement (sure you did, what's the game? Came up with a plot?) – Zan700 Feb 17 '22 at 13:19
@IlyaTretyakov: To a first approximation, "I built that ship" *does* mean "I built it from start to finish". My father was a bricklayer, but even if he'd laid every singe brick used to build a house, if he were to point to it years layer and say *I built that house, someone might (pedantically) point out that he didn't do everything himself from start to finish (if you built something, that's usually taken to mean you did it yourself, from start to finish*). – FumbleFingers Feb 17 '22 at 15:42
@FumbleFingers, OK, Imagine you've started building a wooden ship. You've been building it for two weeks. Later in the future, you decide not to continue. You've stopped building the ship and decided never to continue. Later the person who gave you the present asks you: Have you ever built that wooden ship that I gave you as a present? Can you answer with "Yes, I have, but I didn't finish it." ?? – IlyaTretyakov Feb 17 '22 at 18:18
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Please note that comments are not for discussion. Those who think the question is interesting enough should vote to reopen so they can post their own answer. – Andrew Leach Feb 17 '22 at 18:28
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@AndrewLeach Who even decided to shut it down? Let people talk, don't be so autocratic. – IlyaTretyakov Feb 17 '22 at 18:34
@Ilya It was three members of the community, not me. But as a moderator, I can shut down discussion in comments, I do, and I will. – Andrew Leach Feb 17 '22 at 18:36
@IlyaTretyakov: No, you can't respond to the question Have you ever built that wooden ship that I gave you as a present? with Yes, I have, but I didn't finish it. In such contexts, *built* must always imply *finished building. Note that if the questioner knew in advance that you'd definitely started* building the ship on the day he gave it to you, he would not phrase his question like that anyway. He'd ask *Did you ever finish building that ship?* – FumbleFingers Feb 18 '22 at 11:21
@Andrew: I'm not convinced my comments under your answer here are "inappropriate discussion". I'm responding to the OP's requests for further clarification - which might be considered relevant to you, since you may decide at some point to incorporate some of what's I've said into your answer. I'm assuming the basic principle here would be that if it seems to you OP ends up understanding things better after reading my comments, you'd want your answer text to be such that he (or *someone like him*, in the future) could have gained that understanding from there, not from the comments. – FumbleFingers Feb 18 '22 at 11:29
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@Fumblefingers (and indeed everyone else) I'm happy with my answer, as it applies to the OP's presented rule. It may be that the question is better placed on ELL; it may be that there's a better answer to be had. I do think that closing was the wrong thing to do. Happily the question is now reopened and additional answers are possible, which renders all the comments here superfluous. – Andrew Leach Feb 18 '22 at 11:35

What is finished the verb or the object?

2 Answers2